My 2¢ on the Impeachment Trial, etc.

Introduction:
Warning; considering the topic, you may or may not be prepared for frank discussion; i.e. this letter is PG-13 rated. If you're completely uninterested in hearing more about this, you have every right to delete this letter and not read it, however, you might be interested in a Christian perspective that just wants the legal, just actions to take place, and get ON with it, already. i.e. STOP whining that congress and the senate are wasting our time, when it was only ONE PERSON responsible for getting us into all this mess; we can't circumvent the law to make it easier, that's why it's the LAW.

I can almost guarantee a fresh perspective here. I haven't seen anything like this elsewhere, and I've seen countless hours of this whole story. If after you read this, you think I'm 'people bashing', thus breaking the rule#1 of the group, please re-read the letter, as you've missed the point; this letter is NOT the typical conservative, bash the president commentary, rather a fair look at the current situation.

A heads-up so you know where this letter 'came from'. I wrote a letter to my senator, whom is an extremely liberal, no-holds-barred, anything the people want, kinda guy. (5% moral voting, based on Concerned Women for America, and the Christian Coalition). By chance, a day later, I got a letter from a non-religious, Jewish friend of mine, who got a letter from a 'Jewish' friend of his, trying to say that Clinton's action's were OK because "The Talmud" doesn't define Clinton's actions as adultery, only "onanism" (defined as masturbation or Coitus interruptus in my dictionary). This really got under my skin, for two reasons, 1) I'm quite certain that the Jewish understanding of our shared old testament is that what Clinton did was wrong, and 2) THE problem with the Clinton situation is NOT that he had an adulterous affair (well, that's PART of the problem), it's the general scope of evil that abounds. You'll see what I mean when you read through.

I pasted the original "Talmud" letter at the bottom, for reference. The first letter below is my reply to my friend, (non-religious, Jew, and the second letter below is the letter I just happened to write a day or two earlier, to my senator. I apologize to anybody I might offend with my frank language. I made some personal discoveries about the 'whole Clinton package', that I figure that many haven't seen yet.


My response to the "Talmud says it's OK" Letter:

Here's my 2¢ letter to my senator. If you have the time, tell me what you think.

Here's some salt, before you start: just because I mention certain 'moral minority' 'right-wing' organizations, don't 'read' that as I'm a card-carrying member, just that I used them as reference of a conservative viewpoint, and one that has some clout in the political arena (perfect name, btw; being a game).

To be clear, I'm fairly sure you understand that I have a religious faith, of Christianity, but I do NOT belong to any organized group, since it's almost impossible to find one that's not trashed with hypocrisy; when you hear people say that 'the Christians' say this, or do this, most likely they AREN'T Christian.

A good Christian will immediately understand that Bill Clinton is human, and deserves to be forgiven for what he's done, but also that if he's broken laws, that a procedure must be followed.

I am not a fan of having anybody 'in charge' of anything that doesn't have a strong moral code. I'd say "that's just me", but it isn't just me. I may be in a minority nowadays, but there are a ton of people that think it's terrible.

It's interesting to see the concept of the Talmud, but it doesn't matter. The problem isn't that he did it, it's that he is so friggin' arrogant to tell us that it 1) was OK, 2) was not sex, 3) it doesn't matter, and we should just forget about it. My feeling are that if he'd have taken the route of "I'm sorry, I'm just human", and "yes, I did it", rather than like all the other cases, try to take the route of denial, until he couldn't. The American People would have happily forgiven him.

Who couldn't understand a guy who wasn't 'getting any', being tempted by somebody 1/2 his age, who fell for him, and offered; hell, THAT'S in the BIBLE*, you moron "christians". (I'm not saying that YOU believe the bible, but if you want to fight, you have to be armed, right?). (Basically the bible says that if the wife doesn't satisfy him, the husband will be tempted beyond he ability to contain his passion; works both ways, fellas).

* 1 Cor 7:5 "Do not refuse one another except perhaps by agreement for a season, that you may devote yourselves to prayer; but then come together again, lest Satan tempt you through lack of self-control. "

Another good verse to go with that, and pertains to this case "Judge not, that you be not judged". I don't want to get wrapped up in a 1-sided theological debate, but you can see my point, right; it's very wrong for the "conservative" side to try to damn somebody, when they don't have the right to judge him.

Where does that leave us? with the LAW. (not talking about the mosaic law of the Jews, but OUR laws). We can't let this be a public opinion poll, and it really bugs the crap out of me to see that happening. This is not a pure democracy in this country, because the AVERAGE person is a moron (well, technically I'm exaggerating here, you know what I'm talking about). We elect people who are ABOVE average, and have more information on their side to make decisions, specifically because we DON'T want the average Jo/e deciding our fate.

The absence of common sense is what's pissing me off. Just as it was asinine for Blacks to support OJ because he was Black, it's moronic for Liberals to back up Clinton, just because he's a democrat, or because they are happy that their stocks went up enough to buy that yacht this year. FORGET the yacht; do what is right. (and that doesn't necessarily mean ousting Clinton, it means follow the LAW, judge FAIRLY, and let the outcome be the outcome). (If we have to live with OJ walking the streets, we will have to live with Clinton staying in office, if that's the legal outcome)

It's no more fair to say "Clinton's done a good job", let him stay, as it was to say "OJ was a good Football player, and I laughed at his antics in "Naked Gun", since he's Black too, he must be acquitted!". When I break the law, or am even accused of it, I have to pay the penalties, or fight the fight. Why is this so hard for the average person to understand? Is 100IQ really that butt dumb?

If there wasn't so much bullshit bickering, this would have been over with 6 months ago, and either we'd have a new president, or we'd have the same crappy one, either way. (You'll see below that I'm less of a fan of Gore (by far, actually), so I'm not in any hurry to bump him up to the top spot).

I really hope you aren't offended by my following 'bible-talk'. I have a belief system deeply rooted in the Bible, so it's tough to separate my moral bases from the bible when I'm talking.

How ironic is it that the one example used of somebody being brought forth for judgement to Jesus in the Bible, based on the mosaic law was for adultery; what did he say? "let the person who is blameless execute judgement"; nobody was left. What does this say to you? There is a lot of wisdom in the bible, regardless of if you believe in the source.

The bible says that if you 'hate' somebody, you are guilty of murder, yet so much hate is demonstrated by these people, on BOTH sides of this argument, it's ridiculous! These same people are trying to use the Bible, or the Torah, or whatever, to back up their 'conservative' viewpoint, that he should be crucified for his actions. This is clearly NOT what the Bible teaches. However, the bible DOES teach that we are to be accountable for our actions; here's one example "Ex 22:9 "For every breach of trust, whether it is for ox, for ass, for sheep, for clothing, or for any kind of lost thing, of which one says, 'This is it,' the case of both parties shall come before God; he whom God shall condemn shall pay double to his neighbor." (now before anybody quips out 'oy, that's old testament stuff, though, note, that the MORAL rules taught by the old testament still apply, it's the ritual laws that were changed by Jesus' first coming; i.e. sacrifices, etc.)

My good friend, Nichole once told me "she's not a Christian" to me, and my honest answer is that I don't love her any less because of it. her response was "That doesn't sound like the 'other' Christians [she knew]". "Not very good ones", I said.

oh, in the dictionary I use:
a-dul-ter-y n.
Voluntary sexual intercourse between a married person and a partner other than the lawful spouse.

well, I guess he was right! <grin> although it doesn't agree with the definition from your forward (spouse and another spouse), rather more like the typical 'Christian' belief, albeit not including oral sex, I have to go with common-sense here. As a comedian I was watching just today said "if oral sex isn't adultery, it should have been announced publicly in the ninth grade!" Of COURSE it's adultery, virtually nobody will argue that point, just the typical democratic super-liberal tries to baffle everybody by saying that the republicans, because they are being conservative, have a problem with THAT issue, when it really has never been a sex issue, just a cover-up issue.

Anybody interested in some very wild viewpoints regarding the Clintons, etc., check out The Cutting Edge

Thoughts?
-awr

My Letter to my [wicked] senator.

From: "Andrew Wynn Rouse" <aw@rouse.com>
To: senator@feingold.senate.gov
Subject: My 2¢ on the Impeachement Trial
Date: Wed, Jan 13, 1999, 4:46 AM

Russ, Russ, Russ,

I'm not a big fan of yours, I'll be honest; I'm a huge fan of Neuman [conservative Bible-believing, Christian opponent in last election], because I support people who back their moral principles on the Bible more than the whim of the people. I have to admit, if we have a 'representative' government, and the People are like YOU, that's fair enough, but I have to temper your glee in winning with some sobering notes: without Milwaukee and Madison (the most amoral City in the Midwest; I'm from there; I know), you lost BAD, BABY. It made my heart sing to see how many people out there put up a fight against the drone of liberals out there, regardless if we lost. I'm very saddened by your terrible voting record in the past in regard to voting in a moral, upright way. 5% on the Christian Coalition, and the Concerned Women for America. OUCH, even Kohl [considered liberal to the point of scary] scored better. Anyhow, if you want to stay in office, I recommend researching what the bible talks about in regard to moral choices. There is a HUGE growing push in this country, and it's getting tired of people trying to remove the biblical-standard based laws and replace them with ideas of man; not a good idea for YOU, not a good idea for ME. You can screw with ME, but don't mess with GOD, you will be sorry, and it just might be too late.


The credit of the wisest man ever known [typically] goes to King Solomon. When trying to find advice on what to do, it is wise to consult the thoughts of the wisest person you can find, and if he's dead, read what he's said, and learn.

A quote from King Solomon:

"He who says to the wicked, 'You are righteous and innocent' -- peoples will curse him, nations will defy and abhor him. But to those upright judges who rebuke the wicked, it will go well with them and they will find delight, and a good blessing will be upon them."

This great nation of ours is due a great blessing if we follow the right path.

Since the word "wicked" really isn't commonplace in English today, I have pulled dictionary definitions to make my point clear. I will highlight the applicable words below: (my comments in blue)
Please read to the bottom; my conclusion is there.


wick-ed adj.

  1. Evil by nature and in practice. See Synonyms at bad1.
  2. Playfully malicious or mischievous: a wicked prank; a critic's wicked wit. Ever heard the term "Slick Willy"?
  3. Severe and distressing: a wicked cough; a wicked gash; wicked driving conditions.
  4. Highly offensive; obnoxious: a wicked stench. You don't have to be from the religious right to be offended here.
  5. Slang. Strikingly good, effective, or skillful: a wicked curve ball; a wicked imitation. Perfect application of the word

(5 out of 5)

e-vil

  1. Morally bad or wrong; wicked: an evil tyrant. See Synonyms at bad1. admittedly so.
  2. Causing ruin, injury, or pain; harmful: the evil effects of a poor diet. obviously the case.
  3. Characterized by or indicating future misfortune; ominous: evil omens. what future GOOD can come of his acts?
  4. Bad or blameworthy by report; infamous: an evil reputation. does anybody dispute this?
  5. Characterized by anger or spite; malicious: an evil temper. Holy metal rocks, Batman, have you ever seen Slick Billy; he's always mad at everybody else?

(wow, 5 for 5; I never even realized this myself until now).

bad1 (bad) adj.

  1. Not achieving an adequate standard; poor: a bad recital.
  2. Evil; sinful. (any questions? see above, read the Bible!)
  3. Disobedient or naughty: bad children. (He wasn't obedient to his Wife, his God, or his Country).
  4. Disagreeable, unpleasant, or disturbing: a bad piece of news.
  5. Unfavorable: bad reviews for the play.
  6. Not fresh; rotten or spoiled: bad meat. (interesting play on words).
  7. Injurious in effect; detrimental: bad habits.
  8. Not working properly; defective: a bad telephone connection. (again, sort of applies; serious irony with the telephone reference!)
  9. Full of or exhibiting faults or errors: bad grammar. (again, admittedly so)
  10. Having no validity; void: passed bad checks.
  11. Severe; intense: a bad cold.
  12. a. Being in poor health or in pain: I feel bad today. b. Being in poor condition; diseased: bad lungs.
  13. Sorry; regretful: She feels bad about how she treated you.
  14. bad-der, bad-dest. Slang. Very good; great. (some liberals would like to thing this was the one that applies)
  15. Something that is below standard or expectations, as of ethics or decency: weighing the good against the bad. (oh, yes)

wrong adj.

  1. Not in conformity with fact or truth; incorrect or erroneous.
  2. a. Contrary to conscience, morality, or law; immoral or wicked. b. Unfair; unjust.
  3. Not required, intended, or wanted: took a wrong turn.
  4. Not fitting or suitable; inappropriate or improper: said the wrong thing.
  5. Not in accord with established usage, method, or procedure: the wrong way to shuck clams.
  6. Not functioning properly; out of order.
  7. Unacceptable or undesirable according to social convention.
  8. Designating the side, as of a garment, that is less finished and not intended to show: socks worn wrong side out. (again, fuel for the comedians, not gonna touch this one)

-wrong adv.

  1. In a wrong manner; mistakenly or erroneously.
  2. In a wrong course or direction.
  3. Immorally or unjustly: She acted wrong to lie.
  4. In an unfavorable way. See Synonyms at amiss.


-wrong n

  1. a. An unjust or injurious act. b. Something contrary to ethics or morality.
  2. a. An invasion or a violation of another's legal rights. b. Law. A tort. See Synonyms at injustice.
  3. The condition of being in error or at fault: in the wrong.


-wrong tr.v.

  1. To treat unjustly or injuriously.
  2. To discredit unjustly; malign.
  3. To treat dishonorably; violate.


In conclusion, the perfect word to sum up our president is, actually to even my own surprise is: WICKED! It Blew my MIND to see how many of the words apply to Clinton, his cronies, and even the democratic congress for that matter. (I wouldn't doubt it'd be flipped if it were a republican in trouble, but where are all the women's libbers that are always trying to defend the women here? They are defending the PRESIDENT!) Just WHY is that; I'll let you in on a secret; selfishness! They know that as ridiculous as it sounds, it's better for their CAUSE, that they let slimebags like our president get away with adulterous acts, than do the MORAL thing, so what do they do, choose the selfish choice.

Let us all do some soul-searching and find some wisdom in the words of King Solomon, and of GOD, and do ourselves, and our country a favor, and find some favor in our GOD, by for ONCE doing the RIGHT thing, rather than the 'politically correct' thing.

Our country will grow more, and grow faster by removing our wicked president from office than any of us can possibly know. There is NO reason to keep him there. Let me tell you, I'm not a big fan of Gore, I'd have rather had Quale! But I am ALL FOR what is RIGHT. I've had to sit through punishments, and had to pay fines for breaking the law. If I have to pay up, why the hell do we let Clinton get away with murder?

It won't be the end of his life; who knows, it could be the best thing for him; maybe he'll find salvation? Who knows? I just know for FACT, that what is currently going on is  a mockery, because the ridiculous nature of bullshit partisanship. I guess part of why I've never picked sides on party lines, is that it completely avoids the issue of backing up a LOSER. To quote Dennis Miller "You're a baaaaadd man, OJ". The sad thing about that analogy, is that the (apparently) brain-washed democratic congress, followed by the undoubtedly brain-washed senate is gonna let the guilty man walk AGAIN in the UNBELIEVABLE event of TOPPING the ludicrous trial of the century with the mockery of the century with Clinton's impeachment trial, which if I understand correctly needs a 2/3 vote to boot the boy.

Can you answer one question? How can you SLEEP at night if you think that it is OK for somebody to get away with crap like Bill Clinton does over and over and over and over and over again? If you think this is a once-in-a-lifetime case, you're sadly mistaken. YOU are personally going to be responsible for SETTING our country up for excellence or failure. If you think GOD is going to turn a blind eye to this one, again, you're saaddly mistaken. I can only PRAY that enough senators out there actually fear God, the creator of ALL, and the ONE for whom our country's cornerstone was laid. It's the WRONG TIME to be turning your back to God. It really pisses him off when you do that.

This is NOT a case of sex, it's a case of an amoral leader. Nobody deserves to lead people he pisses on (or squirts anything else on, for that matter). It's just as ridiculous for a Republican to vote against the president just because he's democrat. This party-line bullshit has really got to go. What service do any Democrats think they are doing the country by voting to put into precedent acts like this as being OK. All I can wonder is what the hell is NEXT?!?!

In my leadership training, I have learned that the ONLY way to be a good leader is to #1) Take ALL the blame for failures within your organization, and #2) Give ALL the credit to your subordinates. If you can do this, you will be a GREAT leader, if you can't or won't (out of arrogance, like Clinton), you will NEVER be a great leader.

My only plea it to pray for some wisdom, drop the partisan backing and DO THE RIGHT THING.

(we can talk about the disgusting act of mid-birth murder and the effect that will have in the end-time prophecy of the Bible in a different jam session; there is an entity that KNOWS all, and he's not ME, and he's NOT you, when in doubt, you should ALWAYS ALWAYS error on the side of caution; hasn't anybody ever told you that).

Good luck in your search for wisdom, Help us get out of this Jam, make me proud, and maybe I'll even VOTE for you next time. (I will be most CERTAINLY be making YOUR individual VOTE on this matter KNOWN to everybody I know).

READ THE BOOK, Pray for guidance, and wisdom, think WHAT WOULD JESUS DO?, and vote for US [includes YOU], not for a PARTY! The democratic party will live on JUST fine, probably stronger than EVER, this is NOT about one man, it's about destroying the greatest nation that has ever been on this earth. We're pushing the envelope; this kind of society has never lasted much more than 200 years, we have to start thinking LONG and HARD just WHY that is. I already KNOW the answer to that, and YOU can too.

If you don't have a Bible, you can get one for FREE, you just have to ask the right person. If you have one, dust it off, there is more wisdom per square inch in there than anyplace you will ever find.

Andrew Wynn Rouse


The original letter, proclaiming that "it's only the Christians who are having a problem with Clinton":

According to the Talmud ....

"He who publicly shames his neighbor is as though he shed blood." Talmud

Baba Mezia 58b

Americans have been discussing the moral issues of the Starr Report in terms of the values of Christianity. From the perspective of Judaism, however, the terms of the discussion change. Unfortunately, even very few Jews are aware that Judaism teaches a different set of moral principles.

According to classical Jewish law, President Clinton did not commit adultery; adultery is defined as a married man having intercourse with a married woman, and Monica Lewinsky is single. At worst, President Clinton is guilty of the common sin of onanism*, a sin that probably afflicts the consciences of most Jewish men at one time or another.

*onanism is in the dictionary as 1. Masturbation, or 2. Coitus interruptus. This is ludicrous to equate Clinton's actions to this. It also, doesn't take much of a Bible-study to discover the true meaning behind the problem with Onan, and why God killed him for 'spilling his seed'. It WASN'T because of the sin named after him AT ALL, it was the REASON behind what he did; He did it to SPITE God and to reject his laws (the particular LAW was taking over the rights of dead brother with the brother's wife). The sin of onanism SHOULD be rejecting ether that particular, or any mosaic law!

While most of our moral debate focuses on the actions of President Clinton, the worst sin from the perspective of Jewish law is the public humiliation of President Clinton, undertaken by Kenneth W. Starr with the cooperation of the House Judiciary Committee. According to the Talmud, humiliating a human being in public is tantamount to murder, and, like murder, is a sin that can never be forgiven. Repentance is not possible for Mr. Starr, because it must be preceded by reparation. Neither murder nor the destruction of a person's reputation can ever be restored, so the sinner can never receive forgiveness.

Seen in Talmudic perspective, the Starr Report, with its salacious and often irrelevant sexual details from Monica Lewinsky's testimony, constitutes assassination. For the members of the US Congress to make public a Report that humiliates the President, his wife, and his daughter makes them partners in this assassination.

From the perspective of Jewish history, we have to ask how Jews  can condemn President Clinton's behavior as immoral, when we exalt King David? King David had Batsheva's husband, Uriah, murdered.  While David was condemned and punished, he was never thrown off the throne of Israel. On the contrary, he is exalted in our Jewish memory as the unifier of Israel, the builder of Jerusalem, the author of our psalms, the ancestor of the messiah. His wicked deed of murder was placed in perspective and the entirety of his life was judged, without condemning him on the basis of one sin, as outrageous as it was. If President Clinton should be asked to resign his office, then King David ought to be wiped from our memory.

Also troubling is the rush by some Jewish leaders, such as Senate Joseph Lieberman and Rabbi Ismar Schorsch, to condemn President Clinton, when they uttered not a peep concerning Israeli Prime Minister Netanyahu's admitted confession to adultery. When was Netanyahu ever condemned as unfit to hold office because of his affairs?

Jews like to say that President Clinton has been one of the best friends Israel and the Jewish people have had in the presidency; what kind of integrity do we have, if we abandon our friend when powerful people are trying to assassinate him?

Finally, certain members Congress, including Representative Gephardt, have condemned President Clinton's efforts at self-defense as legal "hairsplitting," as if that were beneath contempt. The term itself derives from age-old Christian polemics that Judaism is a legalistic system that fails to understand religious values of love and charity. Yet unlike Christianity, Judaism rests on a system of law that demands and exalts hairsplitting, due process, and minute precision in its judicial decision- making.

Just as we expect minute precision from our physicians and scientists, why not expect it from our religions? There is no shame in hairsplitting, despite the mockery and contempt in which it has been held for centuries by Christians. Exactitude is the most important feature of Jewish law, and without it there can be no justice, and without justice there can be no viable society.

This country's population contains a majority of Christians, but the often very different values and principles of other citizens-among them, Jews, Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists - must also be heard. Christianity is but one of many systems of religious values, not the only one.

Prof. Susannah Heschel Department of Religion Dartmouth College 6036 Thornton Hall Hanover, NH 03755-3592


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