The CulturePulp Q&A: Jet Li


As promised to readers of the Sunday, Sept. 24 Oregonian: Here's a longer version of my interview with Jet Li. (And click here to read a wide-ranging, hour-long bonus interview conducted a few days earlier with "Fearless" director Ronny Yu.)




Jet Li sounds less like one of the world's biggest action stars and more like a Zen priest.

In Seattle to support "Fearless" -- his action-packed parable about the life of Chinese martial-arts master Huo Yuanjia -- the 43-year-old actor spends more time talking about his own Buddhism-inflected martial-arts philosophies than he does about the movie's mind-boggling fight scenes.

Given the subject matter, it's appropriate. Li is telling everyone that "Fearless" is his last wushu (martial-arts) epic -- and he's going out on a contemplative, maybe even autobiographical note.

The film loosely traces Huo Yuanjia's entire life -- from his tragic, victory-obsessed youth to his spiritual awakening to his flying-fist crusade for national (and inner) pride and peace in 1910. Li developed the script for years, and it’s clearly a story close to his heart: The arc of Li's own life -- competitively trained martial artist since age 8, practicing Buddhist for the past decade -- clearly parallels his historical hero's. (Here's my review of the film.)

I talked with Li for almost a half-hour about "Fearless," the true meaning of martial arts, the emotional nuances within a fight, the tragedies that spurred him, future plans with Jackie Chan, and much more. An edited transcript follows the jump.


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MIKE RUSSELL: It’s interesting that there's no real "bad guy" in "Fearless." Huo Yuanjia is his own worst enemy.

JET LI: Yes. People may wonder why I'm saying this is my last wushu movie. In Chinese writing, wushu comes from two words: one is "stop" and one is "war." "Stop-war." In most action films, people focus on the "war." Fighting, fighting, fighting. Violence against violence. Nobody talks about the "stop." [laughs]
Also, I think wherever you have "bad guys," there's a group of people who think they're doing the right thing.
I wanted to make a movie that very clearly says that the physical is just part of martial arts. More important is learning how to use martial arts for honor and responsibility. Martial arts is like a gun. It doesn't mean "good" or "evil." It depends on who uses it, and how you use it.
And I think this is the perfect story for me to talk about peace -- to use a violent story to talk about a non-violent idea. I'm hoping Ronny Yu gets to have a 2-hour-30-minute director's cut [of "Fearless"] that's more clear about the ideas. I put a lot of my personal beliefs into this character.

Q. I understand that longer cut will have Michelle Yeoh in it.

A. Yes. She talks about "stop/fight" in the beginning. In 2008, China has the Olympics -- and wushu's never been in the Olympics. So Michelle Yeoh plays a character who represents wushu [to the Olympic Committee].
She says, "We had a great martial artist in China 100 years ago who already believed in the Olympic spirit. He turned martial arts into sports." Then we tell the story, from the beginning to the end, of how Huo Yuanjia became this person.

Q. The current cut of the movie opens with its final, climactic fight, and when [Japanese fighter] Tanaka comes out, you think he's going to be an enemy. But then you cut to the rest of Huo Yuanjia's life -- and we find out Tanaka's something else entirely.

A. Yes.

Q. Ronny Yu said you found that in the editing room.

A. The way we originally cut it makes more sense for Chinese people who already know this master. But when we delivered the movie to the [American] studio, they went, "Who's Huo Yuanjia?" They gave the professional opinion that the audience should see me as Huo Yuanjia at the beginning -- then go back into his life story.
And I agreed. Nobody here knows who Huo Yuanjia is -- just like nobody knew who [my "Once Upon a Time in China" character] Wong Fei Hung is.




Q. You've had a script for this film that you've been developing for many years. But you and Ronny Yu decided to remove a lot of historical detail from the earlier drafts and boil it down to its spiritual components.

A. Yes. A lot of older Chinese filmmakers only film their own stories, their own histories -- and it's hard for a foreign audience to understand.
And when I was developing the script, I had the first part and the third part -- I didn't have the middle. But Ronny Yu had a wonderful idea: He used the example of an American Western -- when the hero goes to the farmer and learns something about life and nature, then goes back into the city.
He also came up with the wonderful blind girl with the gift of the open heart. She gives Huo power.




Q. There's a nice little scene in that middle section that sort of is the movie: Your character's planting rice with two farmers, and the wind comes up, and the farmers stop to savor it -- but Huo thinks, "Now I can beat them!" and starts planting rice faster. And of course, he plants it horribly.

A. It's like the city: busy, busy busy. They never enjoy life. They're never living in the moment.

Q. When Huo Yuanjia is a famous local fighter, managing an entourage of thugs and hangers-on, it feels like your comment on what it's like to be famous.

A. Yes. When you're famous, a lot of people are surrounding you -- a manager, agents, some drivers [laughs] -- making you the king of the world. And if you don't clear your mind, it’s very easy to become self-centered and aggressive.
Especially in Asia, I see a lot of young actors and actresses who are like that in the beginning. They're in the restaurant and they say, "Hey, I'll buy everybody a drink!" They want to show their power.




Q. Isn't it unusual in Hong Kong movies for a Japanese character to be as noble as Tanaka is? Even the American prizefighter character gets a moment of dignity.

A. Usually, in [Chinese] action films, they try to say all Japanese are bad. Chinese: good. Japanese: bad. I tried to open hearts.
Somebody's insulting the Chinese? It doesn't matter. We need to look inside ourselves. If they say something, it doesn't mean anything.
A young Chinese teenager will begin to respond to an insult by fighting back. But the true martial-artist philosophy is to have an open heart: "They're yelling at me. They hate me. But I need to check myself"…. That person is a strong person.
If you yell back or beat them up, you're at their level. You’re nothing special. Then you say you're a great culture? I don't see that.

Q. The movie's all about learning to withhold that final blow.

A. That's the highest martial-arts philosophy: having your enemy become your friend. That's very difficult for humans to do.




Q. What does a Chinese audience see and appreciate in "Fearless" that an American audience doesn't? Or can't?

A. I don't know. I put all my heart in this movie. Some Chinese audiences liked it. Some didn't -- they said, "You're preaching too much. I still want you kicking ass. Why are you saying nice things about the Japanese?" These are people of differing age and education -- of course they have different opinions.
You liked this film. But some writers might say, "It's nothing special." Because of different ages, experiences and cultures, people can see the same thing and have differing opinions.
It's not important.
What's important is that I did what I believe. That's good enough. I receive everything.

Q. So martial-arts principles can be applied to how you receive criticism of your movie.

A. Yeah. If you're learning the martial-arts philosophy deeply, you can use that philosophy to look at today's world -- from family to politics.

Q. Bruce Lee was one of the first guys in the States talking about the mental benefits of martial arts, wasn't he?

A. Yeah. I think he's famous not because he's a fighter, but because he's a martial artist -- a philosopher. He fights each single move with his heart -- the emotion and the movement together.
A lot of people fight with only the physical move, without heart. But they can't touch you, because all you're seeing is performance.




Q. Certainly, that's something you and [choreographer] Yuen Woo-Ping understood in this movie. There's a lot of drama within the fights.

A. That was the most challenging part for Woo-Ping and I, making this film.
The first 30 minutes are easy for us -- aggressive beatings. But when my character grows up, you have to have an interesting fight, but you also have to show the way the fighters change and develop friendships -- and you have to put all those details inside the fight.
The audience may still be cheering, "Fight! Fight! Fight!" -- but the two fighters have already changed emotionally. That creates a path for the martial-arts director to create the movement.




Q. This may be a silly question, but did your experiences in the tsunami impact your filmmaking decisions at all? [Li, carrying his 4-year-old daughter, fled a wall of water when the December 2004 tsunami slammed his Maldives hotel. He was briefly missing.]

A. Yes. Of course. This is what I was trying to share in the film: You need to treat your family and friends very nicely every day. You will lose them.
I've been a Buddhist for 10 years. Everybody faces death, and everybody's afraid to talk about it. But nobody lives forever. I'd studied that, but only in books and teachings.
But when the tsunami came, I'm in the middle of the ocean, holding my baby daughter. There are only four of us in the ocean, and the water hits my mouth -- there's nowhere to go. If the water comes any higher, I die.
That night, I meditate. I think, "If God lets you go, no matter how powerful you are, you go. But I still have life. I need to do something." I cannot just make action movies and money. I have a responsibility to share love with the audience.
My other motivation for making "Fearless" was that I heard a terrible thing: In China in 2003, they had a quarter-million suicides. In one year. It's horrible. What I can do is make a movie that tells them the truth that life is not easy -- but the biggest enemy is yourself. You need to fight. Be strong. Don't give up.
I cannot choose where I'm born. But I have the courage to go to the end.
After this movie, I started charity work with the Chinese Red Cross. I donated a million Chinese yuan to them, and I went to universities to share my life experiences, and to tell them: When you see a president or a CEO, there's suffering behind their story -- they're struggling also. You're not alone.

Q. Well, after all that, here's a very silly question: The rumor is that you're now making a movie with Jackie Chan. True?

A. Jackie and I have talked about making a movie together for 15 years. Two times, we were close. But this time, we're close -- and we're going to make a movie in China in April.

Q. Do you have a story?

A. We have a story, we have the money, we have everything. I'm hoping it will come true.

Q. Obviously, it's not going to be a wushu film, because you're not making those any more. [Jet Li laughs] But is it an action movie?

A. The director will announce what kind of story it is.





Posted: Sat - September 23, 2006 at 08:23 PM        

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