INTERVIEW with "Shaun of the Dead"'s Simon Pegg and Edgar Wright!





As promised to readers of Thursday's Oregonian: Pasted below is the way-too-long-for-print "Director's Cut" of my interview with "Shaun of the Dead" masterminds Simon Pegg and Edgar Wright. (Warning: strong talk!) There will not be a test later.





Simon Pegg and Edgar Wright are the geeks of the hour.

The star and director behind the cult British TV series "Spaced" are currently delighting zombie-movie fans with "Shaun of the Dead" -- their "romantic zombie comedy" about a slacker (Pegg) forced to take charge of his life after a plague of the walking dead sweeps London. Packed with jokes and references to classic George A. Romero zombie films (especially his 1978 classic "Dawn of the Dead"), "Shaun" recalls such horror-comedy mainstays as "Evil Dead 2" and "An American Werewolf in London." It was a huge hit in the UK, and already enjoys rabid fandom on the Internet -- with genre directors like Romero, Quentin Tarantino and Peter Jackson stepping up to sing its praises.

We seriously obsessed with Pegg and Wright for a half-hour about "Shaun," "Spaced," Romero, the recent slew of fast-moving movie zombies, and much more. An edited transcript follows the jump; click "Read More" to take a gander.


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M.E. RUSSELL: I've seen your BBC TV series, "Spaced." I particularly enjoyed the episode where Simon's character -- heartbroken by "The Phantom Menace" -- torches his box of "Star Wars" toys the same way Luke torched Darth Vader.

SIMON PEGG: That's a particular favorite with the disgruntled "Star Wars" crowd.

Q. And then there's an episode where Simon's character, immersed in a video game, starts seeing zombies everywhere.

SP: That was the genesis of the decision to do ["Shaun of the Dead"]. That "Spaced" scene is about Tim being lost in that video game -- but we just got to the end of shooting that scene and thought, "Wouldn't it be great if we could actually make a zombie movie?" We suddenly found ourselves in a position where we were making our own television program; why the hell couldn't we make a movie?
At the time, because ["Spaced"] was a very cinematic show, British film companies were going, "Do you have any ideas that you'd like to get on the big screen?" Edgar and I said, "Well, yes -- we want to do a kind of romantic zombie comedy." It sounds like the worst idea to pitch, but a lot of people were very keen.

Q. Well, there's a long history of comedy and horror mixing really well. There's "Braindead" and "Return of the Living Dead" and "An American Werewolf in London" -- but it goes all the way back to Abbott & Costello.

SP: Oh, yeah. The film that most inspired us was "American Werewolf" -- because it really does manage to combine the two genres, never to the detriment of either one.
In "Return of the Living Dead," the horror is funny. Same with "Braindead," which we absolutely adore. Whereas in "American Werewolf," there is horror and comedy, and never the twain shall meet. All the horror is extremely scary and all the comedy is extremely funny -- but never at the expense of the other one.





Q. One of the things that really struck me about "Shaun of the Dead" is that it's a legitimate entry in George A. Romero's zombie-movie universe. It doesn't contradict the Romero "zombie mythology" in any way.

SP: Yeah. That's what we wanted it to be.

EDGAR WRIGHT: We had this idea when we were first writing it. We liked the idea that it could be seen as a companion film -- that if the [Romero-zombie] epidemic is happening in Pittsburgh, this is what's happening in London.
When we were pitching it, we said, "If 'Dawn of the Dead' was 'Hamlet,' then 'Shaun of the Dead' is 'Rosencrantz and Guildenstern are Dead' -- or 'Undead.'"

SP: We utterly embraced George's take on the zombie, as well. Because the zombie that people know and love has evolved a lot over the years -- you've got "Return of the Living Dead," where they can speak and they don't die no matter what you do; you've got the recent slew of films, where they're sort of running around like overcaffeinated teenagers; and then you've got George's zombie, which is kind of a little mix of everything -- you've got the voodoo zombie mixed up with a bit of vampirism with a bit of werewolf [via] the infected bite…. That's the interpretation we really love, because it's just so weird and spooky.

Q. Has Romero seen "Shaun of the Dead"?

EW: Yeah. His quote's on the poster, which is pretty amazing.
As soon as we finished ["Shaun"] and we had the first UK screening, I told Universal, "We have to send a print to Romero." So we got in touch with him through his agent and sent a print to his holiday home in Florida.
He watched it at like 10 o'clock in the morning -- and we spent a very nerve-wracking day trying to figure out the time difference between Florida and London. When we hadn't heard anything for two hours, we were panicking. And our producer, Jim, ran up and said, "I've got some bad news: Romero walked out after 15 minutes." And we were like, "No way!" And he goes, "No, I'm kidding. He had to take his mother-in-law to the hospital."
He finally watched it, and then on a Friday night, me and Simon each spoke to him on the phone for a half-hour each. I remember being slightly choked up on the phone, and my girlfriend was in the flat, and I was running around with the cordless phone like a sort of over-excited puppy.





Q. Have either of you guys talked to Ken Foree? [The star of the original "Dawn of the Dead" is immortalized in "Shaun of the Dead": Shaun works at "Foree Electric," and wears a "Foree Electric" name tag.]

SP: He's one of our good friends.

EW: Our new drinking buddy. [laughs] We met him at the San Diego Comic-Con. He'd already heard about [Foree Electric]; he'd seen the posters and went, "What the fuck is this?" And he was at a convention where three teenagers came up to him dressed as Shaun with the Foree Electric badges.
When we were in San Diego, I was too chicken to go up, but Simon went up. He's seen it twice now -- and we're gonna make him Foree Electric badges with his name on it. Technically, he's the president of the company. The other day, he gave us Ken Foree shot glasses -- amazing.

Q. "Shaun of the Dead" is unusually cinematic for a comedy -- you're really treading in the steps of people like the Coen brothers and zombie-era Peter Jackson with a couple of your tracking shots.

EW: Oh, thank you. "Raising Arizona" is my favorite film -- and Simon's, as well. Growing up, watching "Evil Dead" and "Raising Arizona," I used to think, "Why aren't all comedies like this? Why do all comedies have to be flatly directed and flatly lit?" It's an ambitious thing to try and get the performance and the camera moves right. That's always my struggle.
A lot of UK films shot in London go for either a really boring or really gritty approach -- slick in a different way. I wanted this to look very sleek, with John Carpenter-style compositions, shooting on 2.35:1 [aspect-ratio film].

Q. One of the shots of the year is that amazing tracking shot you do twice, where Shaun walks to the corner store -- and the second time, he doesn't notice there's a zombie plague going on around him.

SP: That was the first scene we shot.

EW: First day.

Q. You're kidding.

EW: As we were location scouting, I remember the cameraman said something to me, in a slightly cynical way: "Oh, a long walk like that is just shoe-leather" -- meaning it's just boring. And so, kind of prompted by his gibe, I decided to put in so many background details -- the jogger who runs past twice, the open door with the phone ringing, the sound of the dog -- in that shot, there's like 15 "Where's Waldo?" gags.
Simon and I also went down on a Sunday morning before we started filming and rehearsed the whole thing. So if you watch it again, not only is the shot exactly the same, but Simon is doing exactly the same thing in both shots -- when he slips on the curb, but also every scratch and yawn and sniff and shrug is all choreographed. I'm glad it holds the attention. The DP was glad, as well. [laughs]





Q. It seems to me that "Shaun" also fits into the evolving genre, in the wake of "Fight Club," of dark comedies about "30-year-old boys." You guys went out and found another social metaphor for zombies.

SP: The great thing about zombies is that they're ever-changing -- because they're basically us. They can be employed to represent any facet of our development or social standing. If in "Dawn of the Dead," they're the consuming masses, literally, in "Shaun of the Dead" they're the apathy of living in a big city and how it can swallow you up. When the zombies come, it literally swallows you up.

Q. I've been to London a couple of times, and I remember the looks on people's faces on the subway -- very zombie-like.

EW: One of the few scenes that was cut out of the film was a scene where Shaun goes to the Underground station and it's closed because there's a body on the line -- which you sometimes hear because someone's committed suicide. And then he comes back later, and there's bodies on the line. "Bodies?" "Yeah, three of them." It was another amusing bit of gloom.

SP: Nobody cares that there's bodies -- they just care that they can't get to work.

Q. Is there going to be a U.S. DVD release of "Spaced"?

EW: Hopefully -- there's some music-licensing issues. I think, bizarrely, it can be shown on TV. It's owned by Bravo, and I think they showed half the first series once at 2 o'clock in the morning.
A lot of UK DVDs, when they get released in the States, have to change the music. And the music is so crucial in "Spaced," I would rather pay for everyone to have multi-region DVD players that have to go back and change the music. [laughs]

Q. You screened the film with Quentin Tarantino and the KNB gore-makeup effects company at Hollywood's Arclight cinema last August.

SP: I'd never met Tarantino before, so that was a real excitement -- especially as he brought along David Carradine. He walked in and I said, "Oh, my God -- he's brought Bill!"

EW: Quentin had already seen the film and really loved it, and he was going to come again to the Arclight. And I said, "Oh, great -- because Simon really wants to meet you."
Five minutes before the film starts, there was no sign of Quentin. So we introduce the film and we go back outside and get a glass of wine, and then about 20 minutes later, Quentin and David Carradine are running down the street towards the Arclight. And he goes, [does Quentin Tarantino impersonation] "Oh, I totally went to the wrong cinema! I went to the Egyptian -- I'm such an idiot!"

SP: And he got cornered by Werner Herzog.

EW: [laughs] He went to the wrong film -- he went to a screening of "Incident at Loch Ness." And then he tried to escape, but Herzog came after him and said, "I'm such a big fan! I'm so glad you've come to see the film!" And he goes, "Oh, actually, you know what? Something's come up -- we've got to go!" [laughs]
So David Carradine's standing there, and me and Simon are kind of in geek shock. I said, "It's 15 minutes in -- you can go in if you want." And Quentin said, "No, no! David's gotta see the first 15 minutes." So we just ended up having a drink during the film with QT and Bill -- or Frankenstein from "Death Race 2000."

Q. And not only that, but you can say they ditched Werner Herzog for you.

EW: [laughs] I feel really guilty about that! I'd like to meet Werner Herzog.

Q. There are visual nods to Tarantino in "Spaced." Is it weird to have someone you were referencing suddenly geeking out over you?

SP: It's hilarious.

EW: I got to meet Peter Jackson in Wellington. He really loves "Shaun" -- he watched it twice in the space of 24 hours. He heard I was coming over, and he goes, "Oh, shit! I'd better watch it before he comes!" He watched it at 12 o'clock at night, and apparently liked it so much that he screened it again at 11 o'clock in the morning. [laughs] He said something to me which was just mind-blowing: "I loved 'Shaun of the Dead' so much that it made me want to make another low-budget film." Maybe "Dead Alive 2" is the next thing after ["King Kong."]





Q. You get in a nice dig at "28 Days Later" toward the end of "Shaun of the Dead."

SP: I know ["28 Days Later" producer] Andrew Macdonald. I was talking to him and he said, "What are you working on?" And I said, "I'm making a zombie film." And he went, "So am I." I found Edgar and said, "Oh, Christ -- there's another zombie film in production!," and he went catatonic and almost suicidal.
But in actual practice, "28 Days" isn't really a zombie film, is it? It professes to be, but it's really more like "The Omega Man" -- it's one of these contagion movies.

EW: I like the film, and ["28 Days Later" writer] Alex Garland has always been kind to point out all the inspiration stuff, like John Wyndham and George Romero. But I must admit, as a fan of the Romero films, I was kind of peeved that [director] Danny Boyle, in press interviews about the film, went out of his way to dismiss the "Dead" trilogy -- "Oh, those films were kind of like schlocky B-movies, and this is something a lot more intelligent." I thought, "Ooo -- you shouldn't have said that."

Q. Them's fightin' words. There's so much going on in "Dawn of the Dead" --

EW: -- that is brilliantly allegorical and satirical. That may have sparked off the return-fire. [laughs]

Q. What did you guys think of Zack Snyder's "Dawn of the Dead" remake?

EW: The first 10 minutes are good. It was much better than I thought it was going to be -- but we kind of have problems with the fast zombies. My biggest problem was that it was called "Dawn of the Dead." If it had been called something different…. It worked very well as an action film. To me, it was like "Speed" with zombies.

SP: Or zombies on speed.

EW: "28 Days Later" gets off the hook on the fast zombies because it’s a viral infection. I was a little disappointed with "Dawn of the Dead" because it was like they'd seen "28 Days Later" and thought, "That's what we're going to do, as well." The zombies in that were so fast that we thought it should be called "28 Coffees Later."
But I think ["Dawn of the Dead" 2004] gets a lot of good will on the Johnny Cash opening titles. And I like the end titles, as well -- the "Blair Witch"/"Zombie Flesh Eaters" ending. But I said to someone the other day: "Isn't it a shame that there's a 'Dawn of the Dead' remake that's 10 times more expensive and an hour shorter?" The original is so epic, and the remake wraps up in 80 minutes.
In the original, I love the fact that the zombies are in the mall -- that's the whole point -- whereas in the new one, they were never actually in the mall. It was just a holding pattern: [Our heroes are] in a mall for 12 hours, and now they're on a boat. In the original film, these people are going to be in this mall for the rest of their lives.

SP: The point of the original is that people are consumers first and human beings second. There's this whole new race of [zombie] consumers who literally are consuming everything around them. And that was a lovely satire. I think [the remake] would have had a more friendly reception from the purists if it had been called, "Look Out -- I'm Coming at You at Speed" or something like that.

EW: It is very well-made, and the effects are great. In fact, I met the producer of it the other day -- he came to see "Shaun of the Dead" and really loved it. He sent me a letter that said, "'Shaun of the Dead' is my favorite film of the year, and that includes 'Dawn of the Dead.'" So I'm probably too harsh on it.





Q. I've read that you guys are big comic-book geeks.

EW: Simon more than me, I must say.

Q. How exciting was it to write a "Shaun of the Dead" story for [the long-running British comic book] "2000 AD"?

EW: Oh, actually, I was excited about that, as well. [laughs]

SP: That, to me, was an amazing thing to do. I spent a lot of my youth chasing through the comic shop to buy my copy of "2000 AD" -- I had, literally, piles and piles of them.
We first started working with "2000 AD" on "Spaced," because my character is obviously a comic-shop worker -- we had a lot of "2000 AD" props and freebies that we used in the comics shop.

EW: Including Tharg's head.

SP: "Tharg" being the [fictional "2000 AD"] editor.

Q. There are some nice nods to cartoonist Simon Bisley in "Spaced," as well.

SP: My character's name in "Spaced" is Tim Bisley. I've met Simon Bisley. He's a very scary, big man.

EW: Somebody told me -- this is true -- that Simon Bisley genuinely freelances as a wrestler.

SP: Really?

EW: Seriously -- that he kind of does WCW-type stuff. Because he's really built -- enormous.

SP: But the opportunity to do the ["2000 A.D."] strip was a real joy. We've actually done two now -- and they're both named after romantic comedies. One's called "There's something about Mary," which is how the [zombie] girl in the garden winds up there; she's one of the checkout girls in the title sequence. And then the other story is called "My Best Friend's Wedding," and it's about how the one-armed [zombie] -- who's dressed like a bridegroom or a best man -- comes into the living room in the film. Rather than do an adaptation [of the film], we thought, "Let's follow a minor character."

EW: We've toyed with the idea of doing a further one that chronicles the story of the other gang -- of Yvonne's gang [of survivors, whom Shaun's gang meets mid-film]. It's unlikely that there's going to be a film sequel to "Shaun of the Dead," but maybe we'd do what happens to Shaun and Ed afterward as a comic, instead.

Q. So the rumors I've heard of "From Dusk Till Shaun" aren't true.

EW: No, that was kind of a flippant joke, and they just print the legend. We toyed with a couple of ideas -- Simon had an idea of how to continue it from where it ends, and I had an idea of doing an alternate-reality sequel. Because this film took three years, I think if we spent three more years on another one, we might just be called one-joke merchants, you know? We want to do a sequel in tone -- continue the same kind of sensibility and sense of humor in a different genre.





Q. It seems to me that you guys and the crew from "The Office" sort of represent a new vanguard in British comedy.

EW: And also "The League of Gentlemen." There's definitely a wave of naturalistic and well-acted comedy. It's not broad. It's not the British comedy of "Red Dwarf" or even "Blackadder" -- even though "Blackadder"'s great, though it's a much bigger, more cartoony kind of show. "Spaced" and "The Office" and "The League of Gentlemen" and Chris Morris ' stuff represent a different tone -- a big movement of the last 10 years in British comedy.

Q. I saw Tim (Martin Freeman) and Dawn (Lucy Davis) from "The Office" in your film -- are there actors from "The League of Gentlemen" in there, as well?

EW: Yes, Reece Shearsmith is in there -- in the same scene, standing behind Martin from "The Office."

SP: Everybody in that scene [where Shaun and Yvonne's gangs meet] is kind of a luminary from British television comedy. When you watch it in the UK, that scene gets an added laugh -- because everyone is recognizing each individual member of that group from another show. It's almost like another film that they've bumped into.

Q. Also like "The Office," you stopped producing your TV series after two seasons.

EW: That's a particularly British malaise, which was started by "Fawlty Towers." As soon as you get to the second-series mark, if you've done two really good series, people get itchy feet and think, "Oh -- should I quit while I'm ahead?" And loads of series have done it.
"Fawlty Towers" represents that golden thing of having 14 great episodes that can never be tainted. The director-general of the BBC complained and said John Cleese has a lot to answer for -- because all these great British comedians do these series and then quit. But it's that "jumping the shark" thing, isn't it?

Q. Big problem here in the States.

EW: How many seasons of "Curb Your Enthusiasm" have there been? I've got Season One and Season Two on DVD, and I love that show so much.

Q. Both "Spaced" and "Shaun of the Dead" depict guys who are pop-culture causalities -- guys who sit and play video games and make references to stuff they grew up on in the '70s and '80s. Why, as a generation, are we so much more susceptible to making those sorts of references than the filmmakers who came before us?

SP: I think because this generation has literally been given a 10-year extension to their youth. The generation before us, turning 20, you had to start getting on with real life. Now, they say 40 is the new 30 and whatnot. We're living with the advent of communications technology, video games -- almost the infantilization, if that's the word, of adulthood. People who'd be getting married in their 20s and having kids are putting it off until they're much, much older.

EW: And with the advent of video, where you could watch films over and over…. I suppose the precursors to the Tarantinos of the day would be Joe Dante and John Landis. Joe Dante's probably the first person to start doing really self-reflexive films. On the other hand, I don't think anybody who saw "Kill Bill" said, "Oh, it's just bits from other films" -- because he's just created something completely new.

Q. Which so you guys hate more -- writing or filming?

EW: Writing's the tougher part, but filming's tough. It's all tough, actually. [laughs]

SP: I love turning up on set. When me and Edgar write together, it's all very collaborative, and we're sort of in it together -- and when we start filming, we adopt different roles and almost part ways. He becomes a director and I become an actor. But it’s still great fun. My relationship with Edgar is such that he doesn't have to say much to me to get what he wants.

EW: In bed, as well.

SP: In bed, obviously. He's a very sensitive lover. But turning up on set in that costume, with the blood everywhere and the zombies -- that was where the real fun was.


Posted: Thu - September 23, 2004 at 01:02 AM        

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